Stereo Tool
https://forums.stereotool.com/

Preview...
https://forums.stereotool.com/viewtopic.php?t=552		 Page 12 of 45
Author:  Bojcha [ Mon May 18, 2009 12:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Great progress .....
i hope you don't forget to make output graphs ON/OFF saveable.
Author:  hvz [ Mon May 18, 2009 1:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
I will :-) (last point on the todo list!)

I might be wrong here - but after doing some quick listening tests, I'm getting the impression that NOT using the final limiter when Loudness is used is giving a better result (fuller sound, and a bit cleaner also).

To compare:
- Turn Final Limiter OFF
- Multiply the setting of the Loudness slider with the old Final Limiter volume. So if Loudness was set to 3 and final limiter to 0.85, the resulting Loudness setting to get the same output volume is 3 * 0.85 = 2.55.

Theoretically the quality should also be better this way. (The Final Limiter is a simplified lower quality Loudness filter, and if everything is done in one go the end result should stay closer to the original). And of course it uses less CPU power. If others agree that not using the Final Limiter is better, I'll update the presets.
Author:  Bojcha [ Mon May 18, 2009 1:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Quote:
I will :-) (last point on the todo list!)

I might be wrong here - but after doing some quick listening tests, I'm getting the impression that NOT using the final limiter when Loudness is used is giving a better result (fuller sound, and a bit cleaner also).

To compare:
- Turn Final Limiter OFF
- Multiply the setting of the Loudness slider with the old Final Limiter volume. So if Loudness was set to 3 and final limiter to 0.85, the resulting Loudness setting to get the same output volume is 3 * 0.85 = 2.55.

Theoretically the quality should also be better this way. (The Final Limiter is a simplified lower quality Loudness filter, and if everything is done in one go the end result should stay closer to the original). And of course it uses less CPU power. If others agree that not using the Final Limiter is better, I'll update the presets.
to confirm this.. my loudness is at 2.70 Finall Limiter is at 0.90.
Now i turn off finall limiter and set loudness to 2.43 ?
Author:  hvz [ Mon May 18, 2009 1:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Quote:
Quote:
I will :-) (last point on the todo list!)

I might be wrong here - but after doing some quick listening tests, I'm getting the impression that NOT using the final limiter when Loudness is used is giving a better result (fuller sound, and a bit cleaner also).

To compare:
- Turn Final Limiter OFF
- Multiply the setting of the Loudness slider with the old Final Limiter volume. So if Loudness was set to 3 and final limiter to 0.85, the resulting Loudness setting to get the same output volume is 3 * 0.85 = 2.55.

Theoretically the quality should also be better this way. (The Final Limiter is a simplified lower quality Loudness filter, and if everything is done in one go the end result should stay closer to the original). And of course it uses less CPU power. If others agree that not using the Final Limiter is better, I'll update the presets.
to confirm this.. my loudness is at 2.70 Finall Limiter is at 0.90.
Now i turn off finall limiter and set loudness to 2.43 ?
Yes.
Author:  Bojcha [ Mon May 18, 2009 2:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
hmmmm..
i can't hear any difference .. i one moment maybe without limiter i am not hearing distorsion on some mid tones. But it's good when cpu usage comes in question. Anyway i'll turn it off. :)

i have another question about PRE-Limiter.
i tested same song with two different levels.. i expect when they go thru pre-limiter it will be almost no difference in level.
But difference is too much.
Hans if you can please listen this torture test wih only Pre-Limiter and first two songs which is same but with different level.
Early i did not notice this because before PC with Juli@ and ST i have Behringer peek Limiter. Without him this is too different.

About my preset for FM stransmitter:
i'll post it here .. but i wait to come ESI Maya. and put all to test again.
Author:  hvz [ Mon May 18, 2009 9:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Quote:
hmmmm..
i can't hear any difference .. i one moment maybe without limiter i am not hearing distorsion on some mid tones. But it's good when cpu usage comes in question. Anyway i'll turn it off. :)

i have another question about PRE-Limiter.
i tested same song with two different levels.. i expect when they go thru pre-limiter it will be almost no difference in level.
But difference is too much.
Hans if you can please listen this torture test wih only Pre-Limiter and first two songs which is same but with different level.
Early i did not notice this because before PC with Juli@ and ST i have Behringer peek Limiter. Without him this is too different.

About my preset for FM stransmitter:
i'll post it here .. but i wait to come ESI Maya. and put all to test again.
Tonight I'll try what happens if I change the volume control in the pre limiter from "peak level based" to "average level (over a short period of time) based". The latter should report (relatively) higher volumes for already compressed audio, and hence lower their volume more.

I think I'll also change the code such that if both final limiter and loudness are used, loudness takes over and the final limiter is automatically turned off.
Author:  abdulok [ Mon May 18, 2009 11:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Quote:
I will :-) (last point on the todo list!)

I might be wrong here - but after doing some quick listening tests, I'm getting the impression that NOT using the final limiter when Loudness is used is giving a better result (fuller sound, and a bit cleaner also).

To compare:
- Turn Final Limiter OFF
- Multiply the setting of the Loudness slider with the old Final Limiter volume. So if Loudness was set to 3 and final limiter to 0.85, the resulting Loudness setting to get the same output volume is 3 * 0.85 = 2.55.

Theoretically the quality should also be better this way. (The Final Limiter is a simplified lower quality Loudness filter, and if everything is done in one go the end result should stay closer to the original). And of course it uses less CPU power. If others agree that not using the Final Limiter is better, I'll update the presets.
Hi Hans,
I am thinking the say way, as why do we need the final limiter if we have the loudness which can do the same job and even better. But there is one thing i noticed about the loudness, although the sound is clear, there is a trace of high frequency sound when used at higher volume, may be this is the nature of sound when its compressed harder. However, i would agree about having the loudness alone without the final limiter.

By the way, I like the comments regarding the stereo tool submitted by michi95 earlier today.

Kind regards,

Abdul
Author:  hvz [ Mon May 18, 2009 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
I just realized: Because Loudness is set to a slightly lower value than before, my high frequency filter doesn't kick in in time. For High quality, it starts working at Loudness values above 2.20 at quality High, 3.00 at Medium. Which values were you using?

Also, my highs removal filter might work differently on "final limited" sound compared to not final limited sounds. I can reduce the default setting a bit to accomodate for that, if you got this effect at higher Loudness values than the ones I mentioned. (As I said before, I *love* loud highs, which might be the reason why I thought the sound had improved...)
Author:  hvz [ Mon May 18, 2009 8:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
Ok, I heard what you mean now... I just compared Final Limiter at 1.50 and Loudness at 2.30 with Final Limiter at 0.86 and Loudness at 4.00 - and the Final Limiter at 1.50 version sounds a lot better (fuller). Looking into it...
Author:  Bojcha [ Mon May 18, 2009 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Preview...
i turn oFF Pre-Limiter. ...
much better but i use Hardware limiter in super soft mode .. which just level audio then goes in ST.
This is better for another one reason. because Pre-limiter have something with multiband and because pre-limiter not works as shuld now audio is much constant.
But Pre-imiter can help in some cases because it controls two low and high levels.
So if possible.. on very first input will be good some kind of leveler.. i supose to work not by peek but by RMS power of material. Then in Pre-Limiter.

About Final Limiter and loudnes: (latest beta)
i try new option "avoid distorsion" and set it at 120% Final limiter at 1.00 and loudness now have little more room. from 2.50 to 2.60. and i get a bit of softer sound.

- one minor bug .. if you open Loudness and Final Limiter window and minimize main ST window VU meter on pre limiter windows freezes.
Page 12 of 45 All times are UTC+02:00
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
https://www.phpbb.com/