Stereo Tool
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Stereo Tool 6.10
https://forums.stereotool.com/viewtopic.php?t=3065
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Author:  camclone [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

stereotool doesnt overshoot ( it is stuck on 74 or 75 khz while playing loud songs)

I ve got this " FM frequency instability " effect on BOTH 192 khz fiber optic output and analogue output .
Both exciters ( analogue and DDS ) modulate that " extreme waves "
and believe me ...they are not __|~~|__|~~__ :)

on sony car radio reciever while modulating with DDS or analogue exciter at 75 khz and a song plays that have max treble loudness with ..max bass loudness at the same time that happens. ( only if both bass and treble exist with large ammounts)

don't panic, it's not happening all the time of the song :) , let's say , for 1 second on 2 minutes of playback :) ( with breakaway broadcast it was happening more often ) ( while using extreme settings )

Author:  eldoradofm [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

@camclone, then problem is not the processing but problem is in the radio.
There's no fix for it other then probably to reduce the deviation of the station.

Author:  Luke [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

@camclone

Sure you are using 50us and not 75us ?

Author:  DJ-DOGGY [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 8:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

And again for Lock band 1 not to go above band 2 ... think about it ..
I notice that if band 2 is goin down , it takes band 1 down too ..
So .. if band 1 is not require to go down ? what happens ? bass is goin down at all without requirement .
It`s good idea to unlock bands ! besides they have separate clippers and "remove peaks above" .
This is a suggestion . I can give anyone settings that only needs to play two tones ( one 50 Hz and one 5000 Hz) high tone with more level than the low tone . Think what is goin to happen with locked bands .

Or only play Tina Turner - Simply the best FLAC and see for what i`m talkin about. Use settings provided !

Sorry for the edits but i found the best for this problem ...
Checkbox for "lock band 1 not go above band 2" and may be checkbox "band 3 not to go above band 2" and all done. Otherwise all bands are unlocked .

May be Bojcha will say something more about
Hans ?

Attachments:
File comment: Settings for the test
New soft sound.rar [3.47 KiB]
Downloaded 176 times

Author:  camclone [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

Quote:
@camclone, then problem is not the processing but problem is in the radio.
There's no fix for it other then probably to reduce the deviation of the station.
That's right!!! If i broadcast at 65 khz max deviation THIS PROBLEM IS SOLVED!

but...then, my loudness is the same as some other stations :)

It's time...to reduce my loudness :) mouhahahahaha! :)

( i play at 75 ms preemfasis becuse its one more method for loudness if also all other settings are properly configured .)

let's continue our talk ABOUT STEREOTOOL LATEST BETA now :)

Author:  eldoradofm [ Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

@camclone
Pre-emphasis for your country is 50us, that's also the de-emphasis curve in the receivers that they use there.
If you set pre-emphasis on 50us and you want more highs you can always add more highs within the multiband.

Author:  JesseG [ Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

Quote:
It's time...to reduce my loudness
I can't believe I'm reading this. :o Next thing, you're going to "discover" that Phase Tornado actually sounds like s**t. :lol:

Yeah, Get your loudness in the treble with the multiband. No need to hide facts when blaming certain processors, because it's definitely NOT a competitive advantage if (A) it's making radios not tune to your stations, and (B) you can get the same sound from multiband with proper 50uS clipping.

I don't know if "(B)" is actually possible with Stereo Tool, or the current Breakaway. But you should give it a try, I think. You should be able to stay almost as loud too, especially the bass and midrange. There are other ways to get a louder treble sound without peak or average rising much, like harmonic exciters. (use with caution)

Camclone... I'm proud of you. 8-)

Author:  hvz [ Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

BETA079:
- Declipper: Fixed display issue
- Declipper: All settings now saved in VST version as well
No further changes.

Winamp DSP plugin: http://www.stereotool.com/download/dsp_ ... 20-079.exe
Stand alone version: http://www.stereotool.com/download/ster ... 20-079.exe
VST version: http://www.stereotool.com/download/vst_ ... 20-079.dll
VST version (No SSE2): http://www.stereotool.com/download/vst_ ... 20-079.dll
Command line version: http://www.stereotool.com/download/ster ... 20-079.exe
Linux command line version: http://www.stereotool.com/download/ster ... ETA620-079 NOT AVAILABLE
Linux GUI version: http://www.stereotool.com/download/ster ... ETA620-079 NOT AVAILABLE

TODO:
- Fix loading changed multiband frequencies
- Add buffer and filter for SCA output (SCA1 ok, SCA2 ok)
- Finish AGC improvement - make mono value configurable (replace checkbox by slider) 1 hour --> NO, not needed - anything else needed? -> NO
- Fix Punch
- Check what to do with new filters (such as bass AGC) - keep them, remove them, change them? --> KEEP
- Save new BASS_AGC setting in VST mode
- Loudness: Annoying cracking sound in bass. Slightly present in 5.00, worse in 6.00, maybe even worse in 6.10. Only when bass is too loud. Much worse than in Final Limiter (at same input level!) - so this clearly indicates a bug. Most likely cause: The filter that was added to remove bass artifacts....... :shock: - No, it's the louder bass. But it can be fixed by changing some settings. Default settings updated, and behavior for 'not Very strict' improved. Also Deep bass boost and Very deep bass protection are enabled for latency 512 now.
- Fix crash at program close
- Fix VST plugin version (does not run)
- Dynamically drop 'Allow louder highs, even if it causes vibrations' to 0 when bass filter suspects noticeable voice vibrations.
- Reduce Loudness CPU load
- Check and remove static variables
- Finish new de-essing filter (check what to do with the settings, remove at least some!)
- Convert Multiband input to MONO, then use arrays [2][4096] --> should give speedup. - FAILED
- Natural Dynamics: Fix or remove transient boost
- Natural Dynamics: Add expected + strength slider per band
- Finish declipping filter (clipping level detection + level reduction in dB). 1. Figure out why removal of unwanted frequencies causes flat lines at high quality setting with small overlap. This causes distortion, with this fixed repairs are MUCH better. 2. Fix MP3 correction, automatically scale down when this deteriorates the sound. --> TOP part fails!
- Declipping filter: Fix low latency behavior
- Always oversample clipping (configurable)
- Declipping filter: Change detection at lower input levels.
- "Test Right Channel" in "FM Transmitter Calibration" does not work since v6.10 (standalone) (bojcha)
- Declipper window close function - check! - Seems ok
- Scopes black background?
- Add AGC start level
- Declipping filter: Add comparting of sample history to make sure loud bursts are still detected properly (now, with 16 blocks of history, 65 samples are removed even when ignoring just 0.1%). I should also check the current block (probably with a margin of a factor 2).
- Declipping filter: Use reliability of tilt detection to determine movement speed; slowly move to default tilt (configurable!)
- Declipping filter: Far too many samples are marked as 'maybe/probably' clipped. Histogram not used or not cleared?
- Declipping filter: Optimize tilt detection for performance. SSE2 for maximum. And keep separate smaller histograms to determine the maximum (should perform much better).
- Declipping filter: Cleaned histogram must be mirrorred. After cleanup, mirror center is place where SIGMA above == SIGMA below! Only use on the lower end. Then run cleanup again! The result should contain approximately the same amount of data above and below. If not, that indicates incorrect detection.
- Declipping filter: Add a long term histogram, and use maximum of short term and long term start clipping level detection.
- Declipping filter: Check if 'No declipping when tilt cannot be determined' can safely be turned on.
- Declipping filter: Add setting and saving of new sliders (history size, percentage of highest samples to drop, tilt detection range start, end and precision)
- Declipping filter: Check why higher Quality settings causes cracking sounds. Answer: Rounding error, and too low filtering values to remove it.
- Move pre-emphasis to end of processing
- AGC: Separate 'Remove remaining peaks' settings for band 1 and 2
- Channels L/R swap in stand alone version when changing filtering/quality (eldoradofm)
- Declipping filter: Optimize peak matching for performance: Move determination to extra preprocessing step DONE; try to change if statements to min/max or something IMPOSSIBLE.
- Fix changing value of 'final limit' in Multiband when changing Loudness settings.
- Save bandpass filter order
- Save all new settings, also through VST interface
- Declipping filter: Change default values for Maximum distortion and Step size (see Bojcha's post)
- Try to improve reconstruction match (should remove artifacts for low bass + soft highs) ■ FAILED
- Declipper: Fix loud bass with soft higher frequencies issue. Do something with loudest frequency vs. peak level - if it cannot fit (Madonna, Metallica) there must be clipping, otherwise there might not be. On top of this I should somehow try to preserve deformed bass sounds (if they are not hard clipped). Maybe this will work: Find loudest frequency, if it's very low. Than assume that it's clipped at the maximum restoration level (?); generate a new tone (using lowpass filter) of the same frequency and clip that at some margin below the maximum peak level. Then filter the input signal based on the FFT of the clipped signal. Finally analyze this new signal; if it is indeed clipped the filtered output will resemble a clipped waveform (visible in sample histogram; no tilt issues!) instead of a sine wave. Use the output of this as input to determine how strict the clipping detection for the input waveform should be (eg. based on normal or sinusoid signals). This is all way too difficult and it just won't work. Here's the real solution: Detect if a loud bass sound is present, if so make sure that symmetrical clipping detection is used, possibly with automatic 'maybe clipped' level adjustment. This should only slightly affect Metallica (which still sounds very reasonable with symmetrical enabled), but has a big effect on DBN - Jack is Back (which is far less affected with symmetrical enabled; auto likely/maybe adjustment based on symmetrical should help even more). Using veil solution now
- Move veil processing to detilted signal
- Switch to symmetrical detection if very loud very low frequencies are present NO, not needed anymore because artifacts are fixed using another mechanism
- Fix veil and detilting display (in declipper window; separate windows for separate channels; no change in DrawWave code needed!)
- Fix declipper display cleanup
- If the reconstructed samples are close to the original samples, and there are a lot of 'clipped' samples OR there are very loud low frequencies present, don't declip. Also add texture based filtering, and use a slider to set the sensitivity. Also increase the effect of bass and reduce overall level.
- Save veil settings and 'not reconstruct if like original' (STS + VST)
- Finish blind interface WAITING FOR FEEDBACK TODO: TEST: Only display this window when needed.
- RDS issue reported here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3703&p=11524#p11524 partially solved
- Remove Natural Dynamics Partially done, does the crash come from here?
- Big window output is smaller than normal one
- Longer history for maximum level?
- In FM calibration 38 kHz is NOT working. EDIT: And more bugs: 23 kHz is not at 23 kHz 28 kHz is not at 28 kHz 33 kHz is not at 33 kHz 43 kHz is not at 43 kHz 48 kHz is not at 48 kHz 53 kHz is not at 53 kHz.
- Use DLL name in INI file name (requested by Jazler)
- Fix clipper (idea: Clip, filter, filter diff against clip diff, apply).
- Add composite clipper
- Add registration to command line versions
- When "Enable FM transmitter calibration" is OFF and you click "Calibrate FM transmitter ..." and then close calibration screen again, then "Enable FM transmitter calibration" is turned ON automatically.
- Highpass before Multiband etc?
- Update presets? (BASS_AGC etc.) 1 day
- Change version number 1 hour
- Release 1 hour
- Add lowpass filter for stereo signal (will cause a lot of extra latency!) - it might be possible to avoid this latency using a Hilbert transform
- Add smarter clipping detection. Maybe something much simpler suffices: Current clipping detection with threshold + flat line detection
- Declipping filter: Automatically override the 3 clipping level sliders if the clipping level is detected very clearly (clear thin spike in sample value histogram). - NONSENSE, this is already done by the histogram function. But it can be made a BIT better - I think - by automatically LOWERING the 'always clipped' slider if a lot of data is present at the highest few bins (but care is needed for DBN - Jack is Back like tracks)
- Declipping filter: Create a new histogram after declipping, clean up and subtract from original.
- Change stand alone version to 32 bits.
- Optimization: Reduce CPU usage when input is silence.
- Non phase linear highpass filter: Make steeper
- Natural Dynamics: Attempt to reduce number of bands by 2 (memory + cpu DIV 2), using bands with sloppy slopes (no interaction between bands -> memory usage DIV 2, out-of-cache reads gone, hopefull final filter gone too -> CPU DIV 2 again).
- Natural Dynamics: Voices, especially in chorus, still sound weird.
- Natural Dynamics: Smooth out different bands more to reduce low-bitrate-MP3-like sounds.
- Natural Dynamics: Optimize situation with no interaction between bands for performance.
- Natural Dynamics: Save settings in VST version
- AGC: Sudden loud kicks (32:40) - much faster drop!

Author:  Luke [ Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

Quote:
( i play at 75 ms preemfasis becuse its one more method for loudness if also all other settings are properly configured .)

let's continue our talk ABOUT STEREOTOOL LATEST BETA now :)


Lol, sorry man but this funny and you must be joking!

You know that at 15KHz you have 3dB more overshoot at 75us then at 50us ????

Author:  eldoradofm [ Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stereo Tool 6.10

SHOW BIG OUTPUT is still displaying smaller then SHOW OUTPUT.
EDIT: Or is it supposed to be this way?

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