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| VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Rendering https://forums.stereotool.com/viewtopic.php?t=2846 |
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| Author: | michi95 [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:35 pm ] | ||
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin | ||
After reset and loading my Ultra Noise Gate preset there is this difference in GUI (in coincidence with the muddy sound). Lowest band ! This value (9.99) and the slider jumps to 10.00 when I drag the main slider in VST version (  and the muddy sound disappears).
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| Author: | hvz [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
The noise gate code is a bit strange and it's easy to make bugs in it. So I guess that's what I did... I'll check it later. Edit: 9.99 -> 10.00 jump should not make any difference. But if the muddy sound disappears when you touch the slider, it must be the preset loading that does something strange. |
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| Author: | michi95 [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Quote: 9.99 -> 10.00 jump should not make any difference Q.E.D. !So this discrepancy is another hint that there is something wrong with the VST version. And that's why I have posted it here as additional proof. 
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| Author: | Bojcha [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 5:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Bump! For the record This filter is More "Noise Reduction" not "Noise Gate" I say this because i would more love "Noise Gate" (for all mb bands) and.. "AGC Auto Gain" - "Auto Gain" is superfluous (main window) |
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| Author: | hvz [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Quote: "AGC Auto Gain" - "Auto Gain" is superfluous (main window)
That's there for people who don't know what AGC stands for. There was no room for 'Auto Gain Control'...
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| Author: | michi95 [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Quote: There was no room for 'Auto Gain Control'... 'AGC Auto Gain' 'Auto Gain Ctrl' 
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| Author: | michi95 [ Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Hans, there is still a little bug loading STS (Noise Gate settings only ?) in VST version. I still use VST Beta 013, but I guess that this makes no difference - no changes for this behaviour since that ? When I load a STS preset in Stereo Tool VST with: Quote: Noise level=10 and save it (without touching any slider) to a new STS then I get this:
Relative noise gate level - Band 1=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=0.639344215 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=0.010100961 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=0.503759503 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=1.56410265 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=3 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=8.090908051 Quote: Noise level=9.999999046 When I drag the main slider in Noise Gate GUI back and forth to "10" I can save it with VST version correctly to a new STS preset:
Relative noise gate level - Band 1=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=0.639344215 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=0.01010096 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=0.503759503 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=1.56410265 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=3 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=8.090908051 Quote: Noise level=10 But when I load (after reset !) this again with VST version it always comes out (saved to a new STS) like this:
Relative noise gate level - Band 1=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=0.639344215 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=0.010100961 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=0.503759503 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=1.56410265 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=3 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=8.090908051 Quote: Noise level=9.999999046
Another example:
Relative noise gate level - Band 1=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=0.639344215 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=0.01010096 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=0.503759503 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=1.56410265 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=3 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=8.090908051 Quote: Noise level=10 -> saved with VST version:
Relative noise gate level - Band 1=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=10 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=10 Quote: Noise level=9.999999046 Obvious the VST version does not like values above 9.999999999 in Noise Gate.Relative noise gate level - Band 1=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 2=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 3=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 4=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 5=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 6=9.999999046 Relative noise gate level - Band 7=9.999999046 It can save values correctly above 9.999999999 (10 !), but cannot read it correctly from STS. Ok, it is only a small difference (and irrelevant for most presets), but obvious it is still a little bug. |
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| Author: | hvz [ Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
These are just normal rounding errors that occur in a PC. For example, try this (hope you can read some code, but it basically speaks for itself): float x; // create a floating point variable 'x' for (x=0; x <= 10; x += 1.0f) // loop though values 0, 1, 2, 3 upto 10 { print x; // display the value. } Now you expect this to display 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 etc., right? Wrong! It will display values like 1.000000001, or 1.999999986 etc.. Even worse: You don't even know if '10' is printed or not... So I'm not going to solve this one (actually, there are much more issues like this for all kinds of sliders). |
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| Author: | michi95 [ Tue Jan 18, 2011 5:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: VST versus DSP - Realtime Listening versus File Renderin |
Don't waste your time for this audible irrelevant thing ! Though it is interesting that it happens with VST version only !? And all other values than "10" (the only exception) in Noise Gate are kept exactly (seemingly without any rounding errors) !? It would make sense (I would expect) that when you adjust sliders the values shown in GUI are others (based on rounding errors) than what will be saved to STS. But that loading a STS and saving it (without touching any slider) results to that all (hundreds in a STS) values are kept exactly and only plain "10" values for Noise Gate are altered is curious. In my naive explanation "10" in VST Noise Gate is simply spoken out of range (0.000000000 to 9.999999999 - and then the next possible value 9.999999046 will be used instead). My naive lucid explanation: Maybe these rounding errors (?) are based on 16 bit versus 32 bit internal conversion ? (A VST2 plugin has to work always with 32 bit) ? |
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