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 Post subject: Supersonic
PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:31 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
I decided to post the final refinements that I made to my previous preset, but under a swanky new name...

Not for broadcast, just for home playback.

Enjoy...

Oh, here's a streamed song as a test... Felt it appropriate... :lol:

http://www.musicremedy.com/musicaudio/D ... e-4335.asx

"Hit Of Me" - Dina Rae

Also, check out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DHWmPlGJ24

http://musicremedy.com/musicaudio/Johnn ... -41285.asx

Johnny Cash's cover of Nine Inch Nails - "Hurt"

http://musicremedy.com/musicaudio/Obie- ... h-2636.asx

Obie Trice - "Got Some Teeth"

http://musicremedy.com/musicaudio/Param ... 281045.asx

Paramore - "Decode"

http://musicremedy.com/musicaudio/Micha ... h-3695.asx

Michael McDonald - "Ain't No Mountain High Enough"

OK. Done... That site will give you an idea of how this will sound, but their streams are only as good as how it was recorded and the stream bitrate used. The originals will probably yield better results, but you get a general idea...


Attachments:
Supersonic.rar [2.81 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:44 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 5:40 pm
Posts: 475
I like it. :) (your intended general sound character)

But for some tracks it emphasizes highs (especially aggressive hihat and snare sounds).
Examples: :arrow:
Simple Minds - Don't You Forget About Me
Katrina & The Waves - Walking On Sunshine
INXS - New Sensation

Supersonic Rev. 2 ?


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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:18 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
Quote:
I like it. :) (your intended general sound character)

But for some tracks it emphasizes highs (especially aggressive hihat and snare sounds).
That was my intent, although I may have gone too far. What I had been researching was the various frequencies of percussion instruments, like what you'll find here:

http://www.independentrecording.net/irn ... isplay.htm

and here:

http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/id12.html

Make sure that on your side you're not applying too much treble if you have bass / treble controls, or too much external EQ.
Quote:
Simple Minds - Don't You Forget About Me
Katrina & The Waves - Walking On Sunshine
INXS - New Sensation
I'll take a listen to those and see what I think...


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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 1:26 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 5:40 pm
Posts: 475
Quote:
Make sure that on your side you're not applying too much treble if you have bass / treble controls, or too much external EQ.
All neutral (= my subjective experience based on a large variety of music).

I have tweaked your Supersonic preset a little bit:
Supersonic FastLimMod1
:?:


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Supersonic FastLimMod1.zip [3.43 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 2:10 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
Quote:
Quote:
Make sure that on your side you're not applying too much treble if you have bass / treble controls, or too much external EQ.
All neutral (= my subjective experience based on a large variety of music).

I have tweaked your Supersonic preset a little bit:
Supersonic FastLimMod1
:?:
Ah, so you were the 1 download that happened before I changed to -6.31 dB on the AGC...

Redownload and make sure your opinion is the same...

Edit: No, that probably wasn't you, as you left the singleband compressor set for -6.31, just changed the AGC to -8.0 (either that or I forgot to change it in the original upload)...

Honestly, I've got "Don't You Forget About Me", and if there is a difference, it is very, very subtle... I think the bulk of the change from your perspective is using limiting instead of compression. You lowered the input (AGC change), then used Limiting and dropped the Loudness some to arive at the same overall output volume.

In fact, the edge you're hearing taken off is being caused by the singleband compressor taking out more... I'm concerned how that might impact lower bass, stuff that you've already said you don't listen to as much...

Anyway, I reduced the 11K band slightly, like you did, and increased the down speed of the singleband compressor slightly...


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Supersonic_Mach2.rar [2.82 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:06 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 5:40 pm
Posts: 475
Do you listen over loudspeakers or do you use headphones (or both) ?

For me your preset sounds better (cleaner than my IO 2.1) over loudspeakers.
But I think this difference loudspeakers vs. headphones is based on the different loudness (with headphones I use higher volume than over loudspeakers).
So for normal listening via loudspeakers (medium volume) it is less noticeable.
But when I turn the volume up (really loud) the high frequencies are obvious too dominant.
Via headphones it really hurts (Simple Minds and the other tracks I have named).

And with my IO 2.1 preset it is the other way round.
With some songs like Neil Young - Heart Of Gold, Frank Zappa - Bobby Brown and some others there is still too much bass booming (also more annoying when I use headphones instead of the loudspeakers).
But for most songs I think my IO 2.1 is closer to a mastering standard frequency balance (CD masters).

By the way...
8k and 11k bands...
good idea !


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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:53 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
Quote:
Do you listen over loudspeakers or do you use headphones (or both) ?
Headphones only, however the purists out there are not going to like what headphones they are...
Bose AE2

I used to have one of the real prized sets of cans, the Sony MDR-V6. I've just gotten used to the lighter weight of the Bose set. It doesn't wear on my ears like the Sony, meaning I can wear them longer without my ears hurting.

As for the speakers, they were (are?) the Logitech Z-2200. They've developed the left channel crackle (something inside the remote), meaning I'd need to get a remote replacement or go to the Z-2300 (or Klipsch?). I do not have room for a 5.1 or 7.1 set. However, even if I got the speakers working again, I can't play them, as the people in earshot absolutely hate hearing bass at any sort of volume. The Logitechs have an 8 inch ported long-throw sub being pushed at 120W, so it's relatively loud bass.
Quote:
But when I turn the volume up (really loud) the high frequencies are obvious too dominant.
Via headphones it really hurts (Simple Minds and the other tracks I have named).
Either you have better hearing in the higher frequency range than I do, or you're cranking volume up way high, and it's actually probably back in the 3.2 or 5.5 bands. One other thought is that it could be the top band...
Quote:
And with my IO 2.1 preset it is the other way round.
With some songs like Neil Young - Heart Of Gold, Frank Zappa - Bobby Brown and some others there is still too much bass booming (also more annoying when I use headphones instead of the loudspeakers).
I'm working on that. The thing is, it's more prevalent on older music, not so much newer...
Quote:
But for most songs I think my IO 2.1 is closer to a mastering standard frequency balance (CD masters).
I think that yours is still too heavy between 150 and 800. I think mine is too heavy from 80-150, so my next thought is to try to work with the bass boost filter and maybe reduce the 2nd and 3rd band slightly...
Quote:
By the way...
8k and 11k bands...
good idea !
Bojcha's idea. That too might need slight refinement, like maybe changing to 7.5k and 10.5k... Not sure...


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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:23 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
Supersonic, Mach 3

*Note: I only can only do 1 more major revision before I go Hypersonic... 8-)

This version shifted the sound profile down some.

- The 1.5K and 3.2K bands in multiband have been replaced with 1.4K and 2.8K respectively.
- The 70 and 200 bands to 80 and 170, attempting to give better control over the top end of the bass frequencies.
- A few clipping and/or EQ changes.
- Bass boost maximum reduced to 300 and harmonics increased to 900.
- Original style de-esser put back in at -6 dB, to help michi's hearing some... ;)
- Slight change in Clean/Punch slider towards Clean
- Deep Boost in Loudness increased from 25 to 33 to help offset the perceived loss of the lowest frequencies due to the multiband changes.

@michi - I still feel that fundamentally your preset has too much midrange. I'm guessing that's why you think the highs are too loud...because your midrange is helping mask it.


Attachments:
Supersonic_Mach3.rar [2.8 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:34 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 885
I'm not done with what I'm wanting to do, but I'm looking for feedback...

This is less "hot" than the last one, meaning I've lowered the AGC target level to -9 from -6.

I've also significantly changed the multiband attack and decay settings for the first 2 bands (bass), and made some other changes here and there to the way bass is being processed.

Michi at one point though the highs were too strong, but I think that's under control now.

Thoughts?


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sstest16.rar [2.92 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: Supersonic
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 5:40 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 5:40 pm
Posts: 475
Quote:
Michi at one point though the highs were too strong, but I think that's under control now.
Indeed it is now much better than before. :D
Quote:
I'm not done with what I'm wanting to do
What comes next ? :)


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