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 Post subject: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:37 am 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
Very nice software. I know it's still a work in progress.

I use it to re-broadcast a talk radio internet stream to FM transmitter.
I'm testing it on a machine this week.

So far, I've only run across one bug.

When changing from a 24khz internet stream to a 44khz mp3 file,
it will do a chimpmunk sound for about 2 seconds.

Stereo Tool v2.1, didn't do this. Not sure what has changed
in this area between the two versions concerning this.

It would be nice to have a talk radio preset. <wink><wink>

Thanks for the work you do!


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9843
Hi,

In fact, the old version did the same thing - but the new version has a lot of new settings that introduce a much larger delay, so instead of 0.1 seconds, it can now take up to a few seconds. I could replace the chipmunks by silence - will put that on my to-do list.

Do you have any suggestions for the talk radio preset?


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:51 pm 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
"Do you have any suggestions for the talk radio preset?"

I will get back with you on that, as soon as I've played with it some.


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:38 pm 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
By the way -- I've got an idea I wanna run past ya.

I've worked with alot of multi-band processors and it seems to me, that it would be much simpler
and more efficient if rather than an AGC, pre-limiter, final pre-limiter and pre-amp slider to
just install a maximizer, set in a slider from 0 to +15db and final limit that to 0db into the multi-band.

Just a thought ;)

I've played around with that configuration quite a bit and it seems to work well.

You'll also gain alot CPU efficiency. My test show about 40% more efficient.

There's a VST plugin that I've used for a maximizer. It has 4 settings. (3, 5, 7.5 and 15db)

Here's the link for it - scroll down the page a bit - it's called T-Sledge:

http://rekkerd.org/sweetboy-vst/

Perhaps it will give you an idea of what i'm talking about.

- tekie :geek:


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 11:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9843
I admit that things could be easier with less sliders and components, but I've added all those to make every part of the sound configurable.

Maybe it's indeed a bit too much for the average user (and if you're using it for talk radio it's definitely over-the-edge - the multiband compressor + final limiter would probably suffice).

For music, I have noticed that I really change many of the settings for different styles of music, and different amounts of compression. (Although I hardly ever change the pre-limiter settings).

By the way, the final pre-limiter is executed AFTER the multiband compression...

How exactly did you measure the 40% performance improvement?


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:13 am 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
Well, I suppose my test wasn't exactly scientific - but, I used Windows Task Manager to measure CPU usage between using the prelimiters and turning them off and using the maximizer instead, just before Stereo Tool. T-Sledge comes out at it's limited 0db, so I know it's going into Stereo Tool at that level with the pre-amp slider at 1.00. I hope thats right, that 1.00 is 0db at the input? Perhaps not .. but, thats what I set it to.

I figure that if the 0db level is used into multiband .. there shouldn't be a need for alot of limiting for it unless someone wants to drive it hotter. In which case, I suppose an overdrive slider would be needed.


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 3:14 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9843
After reading your - and some other - comments, I think I'll create a simpler interface where many of the settings are selected automatically (based on the settings that are available).

For example, the dualband pre-limiter could be adapted automatically to the multiband compressor settings, and only 1 slider (multiband strength or something) would be needed for that.

Similarly, the final pre-limiter and final limiter could be combined - when the final pre-limiter is on, the best results are obtained with a final limiter volume setting of 1.0.

Note that this won't improve the performance, but it will make Stereo Tool 3 easier to use.


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 3:58 am 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
Streamlining is a good thing -- but, i think the performance and optimizing also needs to
be worked on too. I think this is priority.

Stereo Tool has some great features that others don't use. It has a great lowpass filter,
a good hard limiter. I don't know any of the others that use a 10 multiband processor.
Most don't go higher than 5.

Most limiters have a threshhold that range from 1 to 20db and some go higher than that.
I usually don't go any further than 3db. It gives me a good transparent boost.

Just some feedback from a user ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 2:30 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9843
About the performance: Do you have an AMD CPU? If so, upgrade to version 3.02 - it should perform better on AMD CPUs with SSE2 support (they were not properly recognized in earlier versions).

How high is the CPU load on your system (and what type of system is it)?
I'm a bit surprised that performance seems to be such a big issue - on my 5 year old single core 2.4 GHz Pentium 4, with everything turned on (FM Transmitter Soft preset, CPU quality Normal) my CPU load is about 18%. Turning off the dualband limiter and final pre-limiter seems to have no effect at all on the CPU load. Turning everything off except for the multiband compressor still gives a CPU load of 12%.

Notes:
- Set the quality to "Normal". High quality combined with the Loudness filter gives MUCH higher CPU loads (up to 70% on my system).
- Since you are feeding data to an FM transmitter, are you using the 192 kHz or 176.4 kHz sample rates? Those sample rates indeed cause a much higher CPU load. On my PC they don't even run properly unless I select "Low quality" mode.


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 Post subject: Re: Re-Broadcast Stream
PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:42 am 

Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:21 am
Posts: 45
I have the same system you have, with 1gb ram. I guess that will be good, because we could
accurately compare notes.

So, everything you said - i confirmed pretty much on my system.
(FM Transmitter Soft preset, CPU Quality Normal) - everything on: mine is 18-21%

So far, I haven't run anything above 44.1 khz. I have no need for Encoding or RDS
since the fm transmitter does that for me -- so I have that part of it turned off.

With the FM Transmitter (US, Stereo) preset -- these are my findings on the 2.4Ghz:
(These are about 15 seconds into the song so that everything settles down for a reading)

Everything Turned on (Normal Quality): 27-32%
Loudness Slider to minimum: 24-25%
Untick HQ on Multiband:0-4%

RESET EVERYTHING for another test:
Everything Turned on (Normal Quality): 27-32%
Untick HQ on Multiband: 16-21%
Untick Final Pre-Limiter: 7-10%
Loudness Slider to minimum: 0-4%

On another machine (a slower P3-733Mhz) -- you can see how much effect the
final pre-limiter has on it. But, I won't go there -- this is 2008 ;)

RESET EVERYTHING for another test:
Everything Turned on (Normal Quality): 27-32%
Untick HQ on Multiband: 16-21%
Untick FM Transmitter $: 7-11%
Untick Stereo Image: 0-4%

RESET EVERYTHING for another test:
Everything Turned on (High Quality): 100%
Loudness Slider to minimum: 30-33%
Untick HQ on Multiband: 8-11%
Untick FM Transmitter $: 0-4%

RESET EVERYTHING for another test:
Everything Turned on (High Quality): 100%
Untick FM Transmitter $: 80-83%

Note: Only thing checked in there is 75us

END of tests.

Just for giggles -- I went back to version 2.1 to recheck it (even though it shouldn't be compared between the 2 versions)
I couldn't get it any higher than 5% no matter what I did.


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