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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:24 am 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
Quote:
VB Cable, as mentioned above.

I don't understand what you're setting in VAC? Just the output for the player (VAC 1) and input for Stereo Tool (VAC 1), plus output to the sound card, should be sufficient.
Alright, I got it. I thought I need to use the VAC Audio Repeater app. Through all the trial & error with the repeater app, I somehow didn't realize that setting VAC 1 as default audio device in Windows was all that I've needed.

I just select (VAC 1 ) in Windows as standard audio device and in Stereo Tool as Input. As output in Stereo Tool my sound card output.
So far, so good.

I've also found out that there are 2 versions of VAC available from 2 different sites with 2 different prices.

50$ version:
http://ntonyx.com/vac.htm

25$ version:
http://software.muzychenko.net/eng/vac.htm

Otherwise it's exactly the same program.
Same version number, same author. No viruses and none of the sites is detected as scam by scamadviser.com.
I think I'll purachse the 25$ version from the other site.

About VB cable: I don't trust a free app very much, when it's about drivers.
A commercial version should be more up-to-date, more stable and faster.
I was asking for another paid alternative - but there doesn't seem to be any.

ps. I had to increase the normal output buffer size in Stereo Tool to 0.015 secounds to have no buffer underruns.


Edit:
I have another issue now. The volume control keys on my multimedia keyboard stop to work randomly since I've installed VAC.
I couldn't find out what triggers it.
At first they worked, then they stopped to work suddenly and came back after doing random things like restarting Stereo Tool and changing the windows audio device. At first I though they work only on the sound card output, but inbetween they also worked shortly when VAC was set as default-
(I think they should work on any device that is set as default in windows)
But since about an hour they stopped to work completely. No matter how often I change the audio device, restart Stereo Tool and reboot Windows - they just don't come back as long as I'm running VAC+Stereo Tool.
I use the volume keys all the day since decades. I absolutely can't go without them. Enough reason to uninstall the just purchased VAC and forget about all this.

I'm used to random computer problems since 20 years, but they still manage to make me mad.
Is there ANY single function in a computer that DOESN'T can stop working suddenly? This is so frustrating.

Edit 2:
There is even another problem. The latency from Stereo Tool goes up after a while to 0.5 - 1 sec. Then I have to restart Stereo Tool to fix it. That happened 5 times already now in the last 2 hours...


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:00 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
I've found a workaround for the first issue - or rather 2 different workarounds.

1. A program called "Volume2" in which you can specify the audio device whose volume is controlled and choose how you want to controll it. (keyboard shortcuts, mouse wheel, etc.)
But my mouse has a second mouse wheel, which I use only for volume control.
The problem is, that I can't assign keyboard shortcuts to that second wheel. I can only choose from some presets - one of them is "volume control".
It reflects the volume control of the multimedia keys.
So I could use keyboard shortcuts or the main mouse wheel, but still not the second mouse wheel... Not a very satisfying solution.

2. (the better way) There is a way to controll the RME Total Mix app's main volume with the multimedia volume keys. (it makes the volume keys send vol up/down midi data to the RME Total Mix app)
Since the multimedia keys are - like mentioned - the same function as the "volume control" on my second mouse wheel, I can use it again.
(it makes no difference if control the main volume in the Windows mixer, or in the RME Total Mix app)

So only the second problem remains - the randomly appearing latency in Stereo Tool that requires restarting it.
Just looking for a way to make a desktop shortcut that ends and restarts a program, to make the process quicker...
Right now I didn't had the problem since 2 or 3 hours. I've downloaded an audio-video-sync test video to check it regularly.
I made some small changes in Stereo Tool's settings - for example increasing the normal output buffer from 0.015 to 0.02 sec.
Has someone an idea what can cause the latency going up to a whole second suddenly?
As long as the problem doesn't appear, the latency is absolutely acceptable for everyday use. (incl. watching movies in browser/player or playing games)

Just want to mention what an awesome program Stereo Tool is.
No pseudo-enhancements like many other sound enhancement tools do, that are mostly little more than overdone eq settings, or out-of-place reverb effects.
All of the presets are almost perfectly set. Just had to decrease some effects a bit here and there to not alter the sound too much.
AGC is the first volume controlling algorithm that I've ever heard that actually works. To me that's one of the greatest inventions since computers. Haha ^^
Seriously, you can get all your sound on about the same level, even with extreme volume differences, with almost zero pumping effects and with a reaction time that is hard to believe. Thank you very much for this great tool.

ps. I find AGC has more worth than all the other features together. :) Well, not really, but you know what I mean. It's great that you include it in the free version. Still purchased the Basic with the awesome Declipper. Just the price tag for the Spectral Hole Filler is a bit too high for me. Still a subtle but noticable effect on some output. You don't make end-of-year sales by any chance? :)


Last edited by toniostarcevic on Tue Dec 20, 2016 4:01 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 5:36 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
Just a push. Have changed a lot in my last posts.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:13 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
The latency increase occours quite frequently unfortunately. Sometimes it doesn't increase for hours. Then it goes up to a second or two, when leaving the pc for a while.

Have you an idea which settings have the greatest impact on this, or rather could most likely be the cause for the irregular and slow increase of the latency?


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:06 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:50 pm
Posts: 93
Location: Groningen
Hi,

Most likely background services are starting tasks, it could help to prioritize Stereotool one level up.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:39 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
Quote:
Hi,

Most likely background services are starting tasks, it could help to prioritize Stereotool one level up.
The priority was already set to high by default. Right after my post I've tried to increase it to real time, but that led - like expected - to stabilty problems and also didn't help very much.
For now I have to stick with my workaround - a macro to close & restart Stereo Tool.
I hope that this issue gets solved with one of the future updates...


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:05 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9897
I have no clue what could cause the latency to increase. That basically shouldn't be possible - unless it's triggered by buffer underruns maybe. But a buffer underrun *should* trigger a "RESTART SOUND CARDS" which should put it back where it should be.

When this happens again, can you check how full all the buffers are? And then hit "RESTART SOUND CARDS" and check if anything changes.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 12:45 am 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
Quote:
I have no clue what could cause the latency to increase. That basically shouldn't be possible - unless it's triggered by buffer underruns maybe. But a buffer underrun *should* trigger a "RESTART SOUND CARDS" which should put it back where it should be.

When this happens again, can you check how full all the buffers are? And then hit "RESTART SOUND CARDS" and check if anything changes.
Alright, I'll observe it. What makes me curious, is that the setting "Restart on buffer issues" -> "Restart if above" was set to 200% by default.
(or did I accidently hit the bar somehow and have set it to 200%? Would be rather strange without realizing it though...)
Shouldn't the latency incerease every time the buffer is above 100%? I've reduced it to the minimum, 100% for now.
I think it already has restartet the sound card once. (just had a short sound dropout)

Btw. I've also changed the output to ASIO yesterday. What ASIO buffer size do you recommend on a fast system? (you can find my system specs in one of my posts on the first page of this thread)
I've set it to 512 samples. (the sound card has a fast processor)
Still had that slow lateny increase though, but it got a bit better. (below a second so far, ~0.5-0.7 max.)
Current ST settings:
Processing buffer: 2048 samples
Normal output buffer: 0.05 seconds


Last edited by toniostarcevic on Tue Dec 20, 2016 5:07 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:22 am 

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 11:02 am
Posts: 18
Setting the restart value to 100% nailed it. Now it restarts like crazy when starting other programs. Or at least I get extreme dropouts. Not sure if it really restarts the sound card.
The buffer is overloaded anyway.
But the "restarts" (if they occour) doesn't fix the latency. It increases all the time while the dropouts happen.
Pressing the "Restart sound cards" button leads to a complete loss of sound, followed by the errors:

"EXCEPTION OCCURRED IN waveInPrepareHeader failed"
and
"Sound card restarted after Hangup! Try using ASIO instead."

When confiriming the errors, there is still no sound. Have to restart ST.
I have no idea why it doesn't restart the sound card properly (or the restarts doesn't fix the latency) but my increasing latency issue is definitely the result of buffer underruns.

Edit:
I've just observed the buffer for some time while watching an audio-video-sync test video.
ST does restart the sound card properly and it also fixes the latency. But it's an endless loop and irregular. (buffer fills/latency increases/sound card restarts)
I've just increased the ASIO buffers of my sound card and of ST to 4096 samples and ST's normal output buffer to several seconds, but I hardly got any improvement. Since I've set the restart value to 100%, I can't find a working setting.
I'll try a few things now and get back to you.

Edit2:
The extreme issue I just ran into was because I've run an ASIO enabled program while ST was also in ASIO mode.
Strangely, eveny with all buffers at max and an output buffer of 5+ seconds, this doesn't work.
I have to set ST to non-ASIO mode when running ASIO programs (and to ASIO mode when running non-ASIO programs, for best results)
Now I have to observe further if still get latency since I've set the restart value to 100%, respectively if I can find a stable setting.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:51 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 am
Posts: 9897
You cannot use 2 ASIO programs at the same time unless you use this: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=12973

For the ASIO buffer setting, I would normally advise to use the lowest setting possible, usually something like 48 or 64 samples. If you go higher you get more delay.

The buffer filling reset at 100% is really low, it should ideally always be at around 100%. And pressing that RESET button should be identical to what happens when the buffer filling exceeds 100% in your settings. So I have no idea why you would get that error message.


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