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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:02 pm 
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Another question about the new mode of the AGC. Is the pre-AGC still needed for these? As I understood your description, the new symmetric detection should be able to cope with large level differences. So I am wondering, do you really need the pre-AGC? If so, do you have any suggestions on how to set it for symmetric mode?
The whole goal of the pre-AGC is to have a very fast AGC for voice tracking or otherwise insanely loud speech. If you don't use voice tracking etc., don't use the pre AGC.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:02 pm 
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I just added this to the beta post, but since people who already downloaded it are probably not going to look back, here are some reported issues:

NOTE: KNOWN (REPORTED) ISSUES:
- Max release speed is broken! It works inverted, all the way up is still off. But close to that it stops release completely
- Symmetric modes are visible for Digital compressor but not implemented!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:48 pm 

Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 4:09 am
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OK thank you for the info, Question i have about the singleband compressor. Does the limiter distortion from the digital mode also work in the analogue mode? It seems like it does to me, but wanted to make sure this was not some soft of placebo effect.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:07 am 

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:50 pm
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Location: Groningen
Congrats! Hans,

SymRMS is a great improvement!
Thanks :-) You did it!


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:43 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:04 pm
Posts: 105
I'm not really seeing any HUGE difference between Betas 21 and 28... except, what's troubling is the dynamic differences that seem to appear only at the very BEGINNING of tracks. Such differences don't seem to appear anywhere else or at the end. Is this due to the "inverted max release speed" bug?

When viewing the gif, pay attention to the dynamic differences in the waveform at the beginning of each track compared to the ending of each track. I would expect them to look similar, but it's almost like there's some kind of "fade in" type of effect happening at the beginning of some tracks with Beta 28.

(Also, the thing I think best shows the effect of the new RMS mode is "Peak vs. RMS Level." Things look a bit better spread out on Beta 28. 8-) )

Image

Three images per track; first image is original track, second is Beta 21, third is Beta 28; both betas are using the exact same settings (attached to post). Actually, there is one difference... on the Beta 28 settings, "Low Level Boost" has "Max Release Speed" increased to its maximum setting of 24.000 from the default 21.600 due to the bug. (On Beta 21, "Max Release Speed" on "Low Level Boost" has a max setting of 34.286 and defaults to 30.857). Would that cause the dynamic differences that I'm seeing ***just at the beginning*** of each track?

(These are not using any of Stereo Tool's compressors or AGC by the way... but I'm using both Auto EQ's and the Low Level Boost which are affected by the new RMS mode. There **is** other processing beside Stereo Tool, but everything is set exactly the same, only difference is Stereo Tool Beta 21 and Stereo Tool Beta 28.)


Attachments:
Settings_BETA855-028.sts [105.25 KiB]
Downloaded 171 times
Settings_BETA855-021.sts [104.04 KiB]
Downloaded 173 times
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:00 am 

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:32 am
Posts: 4
Quote:
Quote:
The bandpass filter is only after processing. There's nothing in that section that allows for it to be placed anywhere else.
Non-phase linear was said to take place before processing.
https://imgur.com/a/FFEJU That should take care of it.

My original post still stands unanswered:
Quote:
I'm using this beta. Currently, it seems the AF filter is taking place AFTER processing, not before. Is this an intentional design feature? The bandpass filter should be before processing so unintelligible audio isn't affecting the processing chain down the line. I'm experiencing some undesirable effects in the lowest bands in all processing from turntable rumble. In some cases, it will causes extreme gain reduction in bass bands, thereby muting them.
In the chain of tabs on Stereo Tool, it does appear it was purposed that bandpass filter took place after processing, but before clipping and limiting, bass boost and the single band compressor/limiter, which it does. Not too sure why, but that's why I asked in the first place.

If you have knowledge of the software, please reply.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:18 am 

Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 2:39 pm
Posts: 333
PCWalker, trying to explain one more time how you get rid of your turntable rumble:

In the middle of your picture consider the Highpass section. Set Highpass frequency to maximum 150Hz (for better illustration) and hear the different output but observe that the Multiband is still reacting to bass because highpass is happening after processing.
Now switch HPF phase linear to Never phase-linear and observe that Multiband is no longer reacting to bass because now it's cut before processing.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:48 pm 

Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:46 pm
Posts: 281
Quote:
See the lengthy description in my post above. It makes attack and release behave symmetrically.
I have a question about the newly introduced "Symmetrical"option. You said it would make the attack and release time symmetrical. But what exactly does this factor say? The default value is about 3, so what happens if I increase the value, will the attack and release times be adjusted, or is it less symmetrical? Should you leave it at the default value, or simply increase it to increase the effect?

Regarding the crashes in Adobe Audition, I once sent you a link to the minidump via PM, so that you can understand the error. As I said, the error occurs irregularly, but then everything crashes. It would be very good if you could take a look at this.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:32 pm 

Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 2:39 pm
Posts: 333
Yeah, timings and shapes could be adjusted already earlier, so it can't be about them. It was possible to have attack and release curves add up to a completely flat horizontal line before, i.e. being symmetrical. I will make measurements and plots of the effect of the Symmetrical option as soon as I get the cmd version of ST.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:56 pm 
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Symmetry means that a movement up or down of the same size in dB's results in an equal speed. That was not the case before!

One problem is that you can get infinite release speeds - if the input is suddenly silent you're basically moving to -200 dB or so. Which would lead to infinite release speeds. This value controls how symmetrical it is; bigger value is more symmetrical.


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